Die Rosen (Gedichte in Französischer Sprache von Rilke)

Von den frühen Prager Gedichten über Cornet, Neue Gedichte, Sonette und Elegien bis zum lyrischen Grabspruch

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ulrich
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Beitrag von ulrich » 13. Jun 2003, 02:25

just discovered the Private message button = great

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Zuletzt geändert von ulrich am 13. Jun 2003, 12:34, insgesamt 1-mal geändert.
' The immense hazard and the immense blindness of the world are
only an illusion to him who believes. '
--Pierre Teilhard de Chardin

Rilke Fan
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Beitrag von Rilke Fan » 13. Jun 2003, 04:34

Hi Marie,

I am happy to post the Rose poems so that all may enjoy them in both German and English, and yes, I deeply admire Rilke and his works. Also, that is a good idea with the administrator, although I have no idea how one would go about informing him.

I, too, look forward to spending time in the Forum each day. It's quite exciting, although my time is a little more limited now that my daughter is out of school for the summer. As I have said before, please don't worry about grammar mistakes! Your English is excellent, and if you make mistakes, I am sure they are nothing compared to my almost futile attempts to speak German!

Yes, I did read the latest postings from both you and Ulrich, but I'm afraid I didn't understand very much. :oops: There were so many unfamiliar words, and I didn't have time to look them up, but I did print it out so I can work on it later when time allows (hopefully).

Meanwhile, as I continue to post more Rose poems, please let me know if you see any typing errors that I miss so I can correct them.

Liebe Grüße,

Linda

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Beitrag von Rilke Fan » 13. Jun 2003, 05:11

Hi Volker,

Just a couple more comments concerning the latest translation process!

You asked if you can "lock" an envelope. Not really, you can "seal" it, but you can't lock" it, at least not literally -- but of course you can do almost anything figuratively, right! Actually, though, I thought Poulin's use of "sheath" was a very good botanical choice, and I did find it listed in the dictionary as one of the definitions for "Hülle."

Now, concerning "die Langsamkeiten des Sterbens," you ask "what about a sudden death? I didn't understand at first, but now I see what you meant by "the lengths of death." Actually though, I don't think he is talking about the "speed" of death itself (when you actually die - whether it be a sudden death as with an accident or a slow death as with cancer), but rather I think he is talking about the lifelong process of death/dying - the fact that we start dying the day we are born! I had to read this paragraph several times before it finally occurred to me what he was trying to say and how he was comparing the slowness of the rose's birth (being born) to the slowness of our lifelong death process - Thus, he is saying that we die (over the many years) as slowly as the rose is born (slowly considering a rose's lifespan!) :wink:

Concerning the word "unzählbar," I had difficulty understanding this line also. In a literal sense, you wouldn't describe the state you are in as "numberless, countless, or uncountable," although that does seem to be what he is saying in the German - it must be a play on words in either the French or German because it doesn't sound right in English. Endless makes a lot more sense, and I think that is probably what he meant, but he wanted to confuse us with words!

Yes, Poulin is probably a Frenchman (sounds like it), but to tell you the truth, I don't know for sure. I haven't had the book long, and I didn't take the time to read anything about the author - I just jumped right into the poems! And sadly, to my knowledge, Rilke did not write any poems in English. How I wish (for my sake!) that he had! :cry: He did, however, translate a number of English poems into German, so he must have had a fairly good grasp of the English language.

Here is one of Elizabeth Barret-Browning's poems that he translated:

Wie ich dich liebe? Laß mich zählen wie.
Ich liebe dich so tief, so hoch, so weit,
als meine Seele blindlings reicht, wenn sie
ihr Dasein abfühlt und die Ewigkeit.

Ich liebe dich bis zu dem stillsten Stand,
den jeder Tag erreicht im Lampenschein
oder in Sonne. Frei, im Recht, und rein
wie jene, die vom Ruhm sich abgewandt.

Mit aller Leidenschaft der Leidenszeit
und mit der Kindheit Kraft, die fort war, seit
ich meine Heiligen nicht mehr geliebt.

Mit allem Lächeln, aller Tränennot
und allem Atem. Und wenn Gott es giebt,
will ich dich besser lieben nach dem Tod.

Translated by Rainer Maria Rilke, 1908

How do I love thee? Let me count the ways.
I love thee to the depth and breadth and height
My soul can reach, when feeling out of sight
For the ends of Being and ideal Grace.

I love thee to the level of everyday's
Most quiet need, by sun and candle-light.
I love thee freely, as men strive for Right;
I love thee purely, as they turn from Praise.

I love thee with a passion put to use
In my old griefs, and with my childhood's faith.
I love thee with a love I seemed to lose

With my lost saints, --- I love thee with the breath,
Smiles, tears, of all my life! --- and, if God choose,
I shall but love thee better after death.

Elizabeth Barret-Browning, 1850

Viele Grüße, Linda

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Beitrag von Rilke Fan » 13. Jun 2003, 05:57

Hi Volker,

Another question - when inserting an image, is there any way to control the size that the picture appears when posted other than changing the size of the picture at the URL? I have a couple more pictures I wanted to insert with my rose poems, but they come in much too large for comfortable viewing.

Gruß, Linda

Rilke Fan
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Beitrag von Rilke Fan » 13. Jun 2003, 06:54

This is the website address with the picture I wanted to post. It's so beautiful but it comes in too large. Any suggestions? Gruß, Linda

http://community.webshots.com/photo/467 ... 1922QbcHuJ

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Volker
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Beitrag von Volker » 13. Jun 2003, 08:13

Good morning, Linda!

Thanks for your answer. I like your view on the "Langsamkeit des Sterbens" in connection with the rose poem. It's quite possible that he (Rilke) had this in mind.
Thank you also for the wonderful Elizabeth Barret-Browning-poem and the Rilke translation!
I never heard of English poems translated by Rilke before. :oops:

About the size of the pictures:
I found out that the maximum size should be about 600x400 pixel. So if you have pictures bigger than that, you must make them smaller with a picture editor. I did it for the picture in your a.m. URL, brought it down from 800x600 to 533x400. Beutiful picture, by the way.

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Today I'll be out so that's it for now.
Ich hab' auch Verstand.©
gez. Volker

Rilke Fan
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Beitrag von Rilke Fan » 13. Jun 2003, 15:57

Wow! Thanks Volker!

Would you mind inserting it under "DieRosen" topic after I post another three poems. That's where I wanted to post it, but I chose something else in place of this one when I couldn't get it to work. I have a photo editor, but I don't currently have my own web page that I could post it at, and you said I can't post from my hard drive, right? I used to have a page at geocities a long time ago. Guess I'll have to check into that again when I have a chance because there are a lot more pictures from this same site I referred you to that I'd like to post along with the Rilke Rose poems.

Thanks so much,

Linda :lol:

Marie
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Beitrag von Marie » 13. Jun 2003, 19:29

Hi Linda and Volker,

I've read something Rilke said concerning lifelong dying but I can't find it anymore. As far as I remember he explained some thoughts belonging to the Elegies: without having achieved this all including "yes" to whatever happens (even the "bad" things) one will not be part of the living nor of the dead ones in the end. So in a way that's, too, a slow death.

Your pictures are really marvelous!

Liebe Grüße :roll:

Rilke Fan
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Beitrag von Rilke Fan » 13. Jun 2003, 20:24

Thanks Volker for posting that picture. I set up my own web page today, but I still can't figure out how to insert a picture in the forum using it. I know next to nothing about creating web pages. I used http://www.Geocities.com since it's free. It set it up very quickly and it will need work, but take a look. If it's not too complicated, could you please tell me what I need to do to insert a picture from my web site to the forum. I have a feeling it has something to do with setting up a link to my picture which I haven't figured out. (I also used the photo editor to make them smaller before placing them on the website). I'm very frustrated right now after having worked on this almost all day unsuccessfully.

Thanks,

Linda :evil:

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Beitrag von Rilke Fan » 13. Jun 2003, 20:30

Oops! Forgot to give you the website: :oops:

This is the full site (nothing special really), not yet at least:
http://www.geocities.com/rilkefan2000/

This is the one I tried with just the one picture I wanted to post (but it still didn't work): http://www.geocities.com/rilkefan2000/Rosebuds.html

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Beitrag von Rilke Fan » 13. Jun 2003, 23:25

Hi Volker,

Here's another Rilke translation of Elizabeth B. Browning. There are so many I didn't know which one you would like the best. The one I sent yesterday is my favorite of all. Here's the website where you can find them all!

http://www.litlinks.it/bx/browning_eb.htm

XXXII

Am ersten Tag in deiner Liebe sah
ich bang dem Mond entgegen, weil ich meinte,
er würde unaufhaltsam dieses da
auflösen, das zu rasch und früh Vereinte.

Wer rasch im Lieben ist, schätzt rasch gering,
und was mich selbst betraf: ich ear kein Ding
für solchen Mannes Liebe. - Wer vermiede
nicht eine Geige, welche seinem Liede

nur Schaden tut: wer legte sie nicht hin
beim ersten Mißton? Ach ich hatte recht
für mich und für mein Herz, doch nicht für deines.

Ist auch ein Instrument verbraucht und schlecht:
für einen Meister ist Musik darin, -
Handeln und Lieben ist den Großen eines.
Rainer Maria Rilke, 1908

XXXII

The first time that the sun rose on thine oath
To love me, I looked forward to the moon
To slacken all those bonds which seemed too soon
And quickly tied to make a lasting troth.

Quick-loving hearts, I thought, may quickly loathe;
And, looking on myself, I seemed not one
For such man's love!---more like an out-of-tune
Worn viol, a good singer would be wroth

To spoil his song with, and which, snatched in haste,
Is laid down at the first ill-sounding note.
I did not wrong myself so, but I placed

A wrong on thee. For perfect strains may float
'Neath master-hands, from instruments defaced,---
And great souls, at one stroke, may do and doat.
Elizabeth Barret-Browning, 1850


Viele Grüße,

Linda

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